By Jeremy Azevedo

Going into this interview with Rise Against I had certain preconceptions that I assumed would be the thesis of this piece. According to OG rock Critic Robert Christgau, punk rock originated as a “subculture that scornfully rejected the political idealism and Californian flower-power silliness of hippie myth.”

I believe this to be true to a certain extent. Some would say that this would place punk rock ten years ahead of it’s accepted genesis, and that it was more of a rebellion against big, blustery mainstream 70s rock. I could see why people would think that, but things often exist for many years before they receive their “official genre name and title”, so I’m afraid I’m with Robert C. on this one. At it’s inception, punk rock was aggressive, angry, sneering and self-aware, all of the things that hippies and their folksy psychedelia were not. Rise Against are aggressive, angry, maybe not “sneering” but definitely self-aware. But they are also hippies. What does this mean for punk rock today? Where is the line between the fashion and the philosophy?

CraveOnline: So what can we expect from “Appeal To Reason”? Any big surprises, or exciting experiments to look forward to?

Joe Principe (bassist and original founding member of Rise Against): Well I think it’s just the natural progression of the band. It sounds like Rise Against where you still have your more aggressive punk rock songs and then you have like mid tempo stuff… But I just think that there’s, I don’t know, a certain maturity in the songwriting. I just think on each and every record our songwriting gets better. I think that shows on the record. There’s a couple things that are a little bit different than what we’ve done before, but the core sound is definitely still there.

CraveOnline: How has your music evolved along with your new-found mainstream popularity?

Joe Principe: I think how our music evolves has more to do with the music that we actually listen to… I mean, whatever influences us at the time. We kinda write throughout the year and then we’ll get together as a band and work on those ideas. Tim (McIlrath, lead singer/guitarist and fellow original founding member) and I write most of the music. So like I have my songs, he has his songs we’ll meet up at practice and show ‘em to the band. As far as musical influences, we get older and I guess you just get exposed to new music. Even older stuff, I mean Elvis Costello is a big influence for me, although it’s not like we sound like Elvis Costello or anything. But I appreciate his songwriting, he’s an all-time favorite of mine.

CraveOnline: So it’s mostly you and Tim doing the songwriting and not so much the newer guys then?

Joe Principe: Well, it’s just always worked that way since the inception of the band, where Tim and I just wrote all the music. I guess its just how we work. But these songs obviously wouldn’t be songs without the rest of the guys. But yeah I guess as far as songwriting goes, it’s Tim and myself.

CraveOnline: What are some of the differences that come along with being on a major label vs. being on Fat Wreck Chords?

Joe Principe: It’s just more involved, all around. I mean, if you want anything done, whether you want a poster made or whatever, you have to go through the proper channels if you’re on a major label. But that’s just par for the course though, we knew that going into it. Luckily everyone at our label “gets us” and they don’t want to, like, fuck with us too much. So they don’t really try to get us to do anything too ridiculous, like try to get us to tour with Limp Bizkit or something, you know what I mean?

CraveOnline: Oh my god, do they even still tour?

Joe Principe: Uh, no I doubt it! But the point is that they kind of leave us be. We’ve never had to demo songs for the label. Whatever record is on Geffen, it would have been the same record if we were on Fat (Wreck Chords) or Epitaph or wherever. So we’re really lucky, because not every band has that situation, where they kind of have free rein over their music and how they want to be marketed and all of that stuff.

CraveOnline: How is it touring with Alkaline Trio, Thrice and The Gaslight Anthem? Do you guys share a lot of the same political sensibilities and all of that?

Joe Principe: I don’t know yet… I don’t know anyone in Gaslight, although I like their band a lot. Thrice, I believe they’re Republican (I’m not so sue about this, I interviewed Dustin Kensrue of Thrice about a year ago and I seem to recall there being a lot of hippie charity talk going on there… -Ed.). Alkaline Trio, we share similar views for sure. But yeah, I guess it’s too early to really answer that, we haven’t really started yet.

CraveOnline: I was not aware that there even were Republican punk rock bands. Although I suppose Thrice aren’t really considered “punk rock” are they?

Joe Principe: Yeah well you know what, there’s a lot of Republicans, um, even like um… uh…

CraveOnline: Maybe Dexter form Offspring. He owns a jet.

Joe Principe: I know Dave Smalley. He was in Dag Nasty and Down By Law. He’s Republican. It’s crazy to listen back, and you know, you’d think Dag Nasty, they’d stand for something… I guess I wasn’t expecting him to be as conservative as he is, I don’t know.

CraveOnline: Somewhat related question: Is everyone in the band vegan?

Joe Principe: No, we’re vegetarian. No one’s vegan. We still eat dairy. It’s kinda weird. We didn’t make a band decision to be vegetarian or whatever. Everyone kinda came to that conclusion on their own terms. I’d rather have it that way then to say, “oh, you have to be vegetarian to be in the band”, you know? I want people to do it for the right reasons.

CraveOnline: Is it difficult finding suitable vegetarian food while on the road? What do you eat?

Joe Principe: No, not in this day and age. It’s super easy, and everyone has like a vegetarian option, including Burger King. Not that we’d go to Burger King, but you know, Subway or whatever. It’s super easy compared to 10 years ago.

(I’m a little unsure why there is such disdain for Burger King, but that Subway is held in somewhat higher regard. There must be some kind of difference in the preparation of animal products or some such, but I don’t really care to get into that line of questioning. I abruptly change the subject.)

CraveOnline: So I’m assuming you’re an Obama/Biden guy. What do you think their chances are this November?

Joe Principe: I ‘d say really good. I myself haven’t really taken the time to inspect every view that’s on the table and compare the two, although I guess I would never vote Republican anyway. It’s like, we’ve been so submerged in the recording and everything. I am looking forward to the upcoming debates and everything. I think Obama does have a really good shot. I think there’s a lot of the red states that are all, “oh he doesn’t have a lot of experience, you know, foreign policy and all that, and McCain was a POW, etc.”, but I mean, I just think he makes so much sense. He’s younger, he has a family, he knows what its like to live with a family at this time. And I think that’s going to help a whole lot. He understands what its like to raise a family in America today. McCain's, what, 72 years old, you know?

CraveOnline: So you’re saying its really more of a generational thing then?

Joe Principe: Oh yeah, I think McCain’s out of touch, for sure. Yeah, that’s my take on it.

CraveOnline: What do you think of all the celebrities so eagerly endorsing Obama? I heard that Lindsay Lohan offered to campaign for Obama recently, but when they looked into it, she wasn’t even registered to vote. They turned her down I guess. You guys are all registered right? I’m checking your records right now so you better not be lying.

Joe Principe: Ha, you know, I think a lot of that has to do with actors’ and actress’s publicists saying,  “oh you should attach your name to Obama, it’s the cool thing to do”, and really I don’t think they have any idea…

(Right about here I lose connection for around 3 minutes, during which time I assume Joe was talking at length on this subject to a dial tone, that embarrassing thing we all do when our listener’s phone abruptly cuts out mid-paragraph. Instead of taking this time to fine tune my line of questioning, I use it to wonder why, when quoting someone else, people always start sentences like this, “oh…insert comment here”. Especially when it begins thusly: “And they were all like…” There’s always an “oh”. Re-read this interview, and nearly any other interview ever done, and you will often find this to be true. Right about this time, my train of thought is interrupted by the ringing of my phone.)

CraveOnline: Hello again.

Joe Principe: Hi. Sorry about that.

CraveOnline: Don’t worry about it. That was a bummer though, you were right in the middle of something interesting it sounded like.

Joe Principe: I know I was talking and then I’m all like, hello? I think I was completing my thought, I was saying that actors and actresses that jump on that bandwagon, like they did when the war started… It’s like I don’t really pay attention to that. I just know what I’m doing in my life. That’s basically the quick summary of what I was saying.

CraveOnline: So is it more Tim that shapes the political aspect of the band then?

Joe Principe: Yeah, I think growing up, politics were a little bit more prominent in Tim’s house. His dad, I believe, had a government job, so I think he was more exposed to it. I myself am not quite as involved as Tim is. I think Brandon and Tim are more of the political side of the band. That’s just how it goes, its not like everyone is, I don’t know how to word it….

CraveOnline: I think a lot of people just assume that the whole band is a cohesive, like, singularity and not actual individuals you know, performing together.

Joe Principe: Yeah exactly. You know, Tim writes all the lyrics, so a lot of the subject matter is all whatever he’s going through in his day-to-day life. That’s why we are not like a straight political band. We also have lyrics that deal with relationships and social issues as well. It’s kind of just his perspective on life at the time.

CraveOnline: Being a political band can sometimes alienate certain audiences, but at the same time, it can really cement your reputation with others who share your opinions. Do you think your message has awarded you a larger fan base than you would have if all your songs were about relationships and cars and stuff like that?

Joe Principe: Well, yeah I’m sure… I mean, bands like Blink 182, those subject matters are easy to relate to for a mainstream audience. But, you know, I think I like something with a little bit more substance. That’s why I grew up listening to bands like the Dead Kennedy and Bad Religion, you know? They inspired change. They still do. Well, Bad Religion does. Ha. So I like something with substance, I think we all do. And that’s why I’m glad that this band is about that, you know? My previous band (88 Fingers Louie), we were never… we never sang about anything political. It’s refreshing because it’s definitely more of a nod to our influences when we were growing up.

CraveOnline: Yeah, I agree with you there that a lot of the earlier punk rock had a lot more of that element to it than a lot of the stuff that’s out now.

Joe Principe: Yeah, you know, they were pissed, all those bands… Black Flag, you know, you kind of, somehow… you lost that. Like a lot of bands are calling themselves punk rock, but its safe you know? It’s like, that’s not what this is about. It’s about… I see punk rock as inspiring change, you know, and being an individual. We did Warped Tour and I didn’t see much individuality at Warped Tour. I hate to say it, but you know, one guy cuts his hair one way and everyone follows… like 4000 kids have the same haircut you know?

CraveOnline: That’s the funny thing about punk rock, is that the original old school rock critics saw it as a sub culture that rejected the existing, not just political, but also social status quo. And now we essentially have a re-combination of those two different cultures, the “punk” and the mainstream, and a very standardized approach to the music that is supposed to represent an inherent outsider culture. How does pop-punk fit into the equation? When you add the word “pop” to the name of a genre, does the genre still exist?

Joe Principe: Well, I think so. Because I consider bands like, even the Ramones and the Descendants it’s like, they’re punk rock, but there’s like a melodic edge to it. And I think that’s why they threw the word pop in there. But I’m a big fan of that style of music as well. I like melody and I think a lot of those bands, regardless of how they sounded, I mean even the Buzzcocks are ultra pop… but they had punk rock ethics and I think that’s a  big part of it as well. But yeah, I know what you’re saying. It is kind of a fine line sometime. But I just think there’s a bigger picture than the label. Some one can call themselves whatever, a hard core band or punk rock.. But I just think if their ethics are there and they kind of… I don’t know, I just need to know someone’s sincere about something. I don’t discredit a band for calling themselves pop punk if that’s what you’re saying.

CraveOnline: What is this defining “ethic” that you think separates the real punk versus the fashion?

Joe Principe: I think if you get into it, when you feel like you don’t fit in with the what’s expected of you in the society that we live in, you know, I think that’s the point of punk rock. The Ramones started because they were sick of bullshit music and bullshit solos. They felt they didn’t need that and they started their own thing. That to me was punk rock. You know, its like the Dead Kennedys started with Jello Biafra being very outspoken about the wrongdoings of the government. That is also punk rock you know? I think there’s many facets to it.

CraveOnline: What percentage of the youth today do you think are responsive to these kinds of messages, versus those who are just programmed to consume?

Joe Principe: I think, you know… it’s gonna be a small percentage. A lot of people, they don’t want to be bothered. They like their convenient lives. A lot of people just settle, they settle for bullshit radio songs. And the way we’ve grown our audience, especially our audience that comes from radio, I’d say only about 40% listens to the rest of the record and gets what we’re saying. You’d be naïve if you thought you could win the majority over, that’s just not realistic. So it is sad, you know, but yeah I would say like more times than not they’re going to miss it. That’s unfortunately the reality I guess.

CraveOnline: You know, one audience that I find responds very favorable to your band and its message is, surprisingly, military servicemen. Do you have any thoughts about the reasons for that?

Joe Principe: Yeah, we have a lot of emails from soldiers and stuff, and I think a lot of times they join the army for other reasons you know, like college benefits. We’ve encountered that a lot actually. Its like, yeah, they have to fight this war, and they don’t necessarily agree with our reasons for being over there, but they have to do it. They’re stuck. And its kind of unfortunate, sometimes it kind of breaks my heart a little bit. A lot of people, they come out of the army and they just straight up say that they hate Bush and stuff. That was really kind of a shock at first when we started hearing that. I guess I didn’t realize that just because they’re in the military doesn’t mean that they are in total agreement with the government. I think people should remember that. A lot of people complain about the soldiers being there but really they should blame the government.

CraveOnline: Let’s talk about your latest music video for “Re-Education (Through Labor)”. In it, you’ve depicted a bunch of good looking and sexy cool young people on sweet motorbikes destroying a major metropolitan area with bombs. What kind of message does that send?

Joe Principe: Well, I don’t put any thought into… it wasn’t like a conscious choice to use, like, all pretty people. It was just a metaphor to rebuild, and I think people need to look past the actual violent part of it… It’s a time for change and that’s kind of the point of the song and the video. We thought it was kind of a cool way, visually, to convey the idea. Its gonna make people think and talk, and then once they start asking questions about it, then they understand what the point of the song is. I mean, the people in the video are members of 3 or 4 moped clubs in Chicago that just happened to be pretty, ha.

CraveOnline: Well it’s not so much about them being pretty, more to the point is that it makes them look cool, and people are dumb. What are you going to say when some retard asshole actually does blow up an office building in an attempt to, like, “stick it to the man” or whatever?

Joe Principe: Well, I mean, that’s like saying, what are you going to do about someone who commits suicide over a song they heard or whatever? I mean, you can’t blame the music for something like that. I don’t think you can blame the band for things like that. Its like Marilyn Manson getting blamed for the kids at Columbine or something. I don’t think it’s very fair. It’s an easy way out. It’s a convenient excuse. Oh, this person said to do it in the song or the video so it’s cool, so I’ll do it.

CraveOnline: So you are rejecting the over-sensitivity in a way then? And also, advocating personal responsibility? That’s pretty punk rock in it’s own way.

Joe Principe: Yeah, I think a powerful message… powerful messages are required to make people think, you know? Even the “Ready To Fall” video, there were some pretty graphic images, especially in the un-edited version that was online. That video is what made some people go vegetarian, the edited version, not the candy coated version. So that’s why we kind of took that route. And so far, no station has waned to edit it. They’re airing it as is, which is pretty amazing, especially nowadays.

CraveOnline: There seems to be a real culture of fear that prevents making any kind of extreme statement, which you guys are doing there. So it’s surprising that they are taking that risk. It’s likely to bring a lot of attention.

Joe Principe: Yeah. Well, we hope so.

CraveOnline: Speaking of extreme images…You guys are big supporters of PETA right? Would you ever consider doing one of those “I’d rather wear nothing at all than wear fur” ads that they do? Do you think any of your lady fans would be into that?

Joe Principe: Haha! Oh no, absolutely not, we are ugly men, all of us. That would be more of a comical thing… I don’t think we would win anyone over with that!

CraveOnline: Is there anything about Rise Against that people would be surprised to know?

Joe Principe: Um…

CraveOnline: That’s one’s a thinker right there.

Joe Principe: I don’t know, I guess we’re not all… I think a lot of people view us as a very serious band. It’s like, we’re not really like that, its not all business. I think we all have guilty pleasures as far as music that we listen to that people wouldn’t expect. I’m a big 80s pop music fan, I like bands like the Go-Go's, but  I guess that’s not really that shocking.

CraveOnline: It’s because you don’t smile in your pictures.

Joe Principe: You’re right, we’ve gone a long time with no smiles, but we changed that as of late. We just did some new pictures where were smiling!

CraveOnline: Is there anything else you would like people to know about the new album?

Joe Principe: I would say, as far as the record goes, it’s something we’re really proud of and I think the core fans are going to love it. And even if you’ve never heard of us, I’d still say check it out. I don’t know, I’m so close to the record it’s hard to make a comment about it. I think there’s some surprises on there, but it's not like were all of the sudden a funk band or whatever. I’d say its Rise Against but in 2008 you know? Its not rehashed old stuff. It’s a new take on the sound

CraveOnline: I read that you recorded a shit-ton of songs for this album. Is that true or somewhat of an exaggeration?

Joe Principe: Well, we wrote a ton of songs… I think we recorded like 20, which is kind of a lot. But we probably wrote like 35 and we just… it comes to us I guess. It’s like I said, Tim and I will write while we’re on tour, you know, throughout the whole year so we just happened to have a lot of ideas on the table.

CraveOnline: Was it hard to synthesize that into one cohesive album?

Joe Principe: The ones on the record are the ones everyone voted for, that’s kind of the way it works

CraveOnline: So you do the committee vote sort of thing then?

Joe Principe: Yeah, yeah.

CraveOnline: What do you do with the rest of the songs? Re-work them for a later album or just kind of move on to the next thing?

Joe Principe: Yeah we move on, a couple songs made it on for B sides, but the rest are long gone. I don’t like to go back to old ideas. When we start working on a new record I like to just keep moving forward.


Rise Against’s new album, “Appeal to Reason” is available now, and their live tour is currently underway. I recommend that you pick it up/check them out. I do not recommend that you insinuate in any way that you sometimes get them confused with Against Me, because it makes them super pissed. (Even if their names are very similar…) Rise Against may sorta be hippies, but they aren’t even a fraction as grating as Rage Against the Machine were… (Why do they all use the word “Against”, seriously?) I guess the point I am trying to make is that, whatever your political affiliations are, the music of Rise Against speaks for itself, and that itself is perhaps the essence of punk rock. Which is certainly worth something to those of us that have found the ethics lacking in music these days.